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Water Ingress Again


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#1 skippy 2

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 04:16 PM

Hello can any body tell me what is involved when the sound proofing material under the carpet in the passenger footwell is saturated. I have dried the carpet but after lifting it I have found that the sound proofing needs drying out. Is it one piece through out the car and needs to be cut or is it in small sections and easily removed. I was not sure if I need a weekend to tackle this can some one advise please.. I have checked for blockages in the scuttle area and all is clear so Ime not sure how I got a puddle of water I can only think of the recent prolonged heavy rain has had some say in it. I removed the plastic inner wheel arch to check and found a 1inch square hole that comes from from the scuttle so I know it can't be here. I did find a rubber bung in with the collection of road dirt but could'nt see where it came from any ideas !! This is the first time I have had this problem by the way.

#2 gregers

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 05:50 PM

Hello can any body tell me what is involved when the sound proofing material under the carpet in the passenger footwell is saturated. I have dried the carpet but after lifting it I have found that the sound proofing needs drying out. Is it one piece through out the car and needs to be cut or is it in small sections and easily removed. I was not sure if I need a weekend to tackle this can some one advise please.. I have checked for blockages in the scuttle area and all is clear so Ime not sure how I got a puddle of water I can only think of the recent prolonged heavy rain has had some say in it. I removed the plastic inner wheel arch to check and found a 1inch square hole that comes from from the scuttle so I know it can't be here. I did find a rubber bung in with the collection of road dirt but could'nt see where it came from any ideas !! This is the first time I have had this problem by the way.


have you had a look round the pollen filter area,have you also checked the pipe for the rear washer,runs beside the passenger seat.

#3 skippy 2

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Posted 14 December 2009 - 09:21 PM

Hello can any body tell me what is involved when the sound proofing material under the carpet in the passenger footwell is saturated. I have dried the carpet but after lifting it I have found that the sound proofing needs drying out. Is it one piece through out the car and needs to be cut or is it in small sections and easily removed. I was not sure if I need a weekend to tackle this can some one advise please.. I have checked for blockages in the scuttle area and all is clear so Ime not sure how I got a puddle of water I can only think of the recent prolonged heavy rain has had some say in it. I removed the plastic inner wheel arch to check and found a 1inch square hole that comes from from the scuttle so I know it can't be here. I did find a rubber bung in with the collection of road dirt but could'nt see where it came from any ideas !! This is the first time I have had this problem by the way.


have you had a look round the pollen filter area,have you also checked the pipe for the rear washer,runs beside the passenger seat.

Hello gregers, I had a look while the carpet was up I don't use the rear washer anyway because of the problem involved so I know the problem is not here there was too much water all of a sudden. I checked around the pollen filter removing the scuttle plate thing to check the channels all clear and dry. Not even any wet mud that may point to a blockage. This is the first time it has happenened and it seems that it happened after the recent heavy rain. I must say it has got me puzzled. What I need to know also is how do I get the sound proofing out to dry it. It seems to have a plastic covering or something and when you put pressure on it the water squeeses out so it is sturated.

#4 gregers

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Posted 14 December 2009 - 11:21 PM

seem to remember someone had this problem from yonks back,think they kept on putting paper in to soak it up?

do you have a sunroof?maybe the drain offs are blocked?

also check the windscreen?

#5 skippy 2

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Posted 01 January 2010 - 07:12 PM

seem to remember someone had this problem from yonks back,think they kept on putting paper in to soak it up?

do you have a sunroof?maybe the drain offs are blocked?

also check the windscreen?

Hi. gregers no I haven't a sunroof so no probs there, I don't think the screen is leaking there is no evidence of damp or staining which may be evident. I have removed the plastic inner wing and poured water in to the scuttle channel and the water came out quite freely. By the the way would you know what the black box is with 2 clear plastic tubes coming from it in the offside wheel arch up on the left behind the plastic inner wing . I have checked the carpet recently after mild rain and no puddle.

#6 studsmassive

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Posted 01 January 2010 - 10:20 PM

my passanger foot well was the same so as cold as it was the other day i decided to tackle it but what i did was cut it out with a stanley knife dried it out and built it back up with under lay as the sound profing was had it when the scutle panel was removed did you silicone the plastic plugs in as it can get in there , dont forget to check under passanger seat

#7 skippy 2

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 08:48 PM

my passanger foot well was the same so as cold as it was the other day i decided to tackle it but what i did was cut it out with a stanley knife dried it out and built it back up with under lay as the sound profing was had it when the scutle panel was removed did you silicone the plastic plugs in as it can get in there , dont forget to check under passanger seat

Hello when you say the scuttle panel are you talking about the one under the bonnet with three bolts or the plastic trim under the windscreen. Where are the plastic plugs that neen silicon. Thanks for the reply on the sound proofing under the carpet I now know that this has to be cut out and dried. Is there any plastic plugs in this area or under the seats or in the foot well area that I may not know about. Thanks.

#8 studsmassive

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 09:52 PM

my passanger foot well was the same so as cold as it was the other day i decided to tackle it but what i did was cut it out with a stanley knife dried it out and built it back up with under lay as the sound profing was had it when the scutle panel was removed did you silicone the plastic plugs in as it can get in there , dont forget to check under passanger seat

Hello when you say the scuttle panel are you talking about the one under the bonnet with three bolts or the plastic trim under the windscreen. Where are the plastic plugs that neen silicon. Thanks for the reply on the sound proofing under the carpet I now know that this has to be cut out and dried. Is there any plastic plugs in this area or under the seats or in the foot well area that I may not know about. Thanks.




hi the one under the windscreen wipers at bottom of windscreen when you remover it i think there is six clips which it fixes into i pulled mine out after reading about this somewhere where some guy went to a windscreen place and they did it for him i have not found any many people say to drill some holes in the compartment under pass seat to save it filling with water if you do find where your is coming from let me know so i can check mine

#9 skippy 2

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 06:50 PM

I am now convinced that the problem is air/con. I have had the air/con on ECON now for several weeks and no water. The problem seems to be when the air/con is on for cold air and water appears in the drivers foot well. I have checked this after rain and riving in rain and even after the rain the next day and nothing. It is definately when the air/is on cold. The drain pipe must be blocked or has come adrift somewhere. any experts out there please on this subject.

#10 chrispb123456

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 03:59 AM

I am now convinced that the problem is air/con. I have had the air/con on ECON now for several weeks and no water. The problem seems to be when the air/con is on for cold air and water appears in the drivers foot well. I have checked this after rain and riving in rain and even after the rain the next day and nothing. It is definately when the air/is on cold. The drain pipe must be blocked or has come adrift somewhere. any experts out there please on this subject.

Drain tube sticks out from bulkhead down behind gearbox bell housing, if it's OK perhaps the heater/aircon casing is leaking.
Would advise removing as much trim around tunnel and lower dash as possible then run aircon, you should be able to see where its coming from then

#11 allegedly

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 01:41 AM

Hi guys. I realise this topic is covered elsewhere but as it's very pertinent to me at the mo, I thought I'd join in and describe the frustrating 'water feature' in our 04 Galaxy Ghia 1.9. But first off, for other less than technically able types like me, I've included a pic of my rear wash 'connection'(?).
I lifted the carpet, nothing subtle there, just mild brute force. Then, faced with the totally sodden underlay which goes across the transmission tunnel to the drivers side (part two of the tale), I considered removing the trim and all associated fittings around the gear stick. So I got out the stanley knife and cut it along the side below the gear stick and the sodden plastic coated slab of compacted felt is currently drying out in the porch. I then used two towels to dry the small pond in the footwell. Never noticed it before but it was starting to smell...musty is the word that springs to mind.
Using a contact screwdriver, a small flat headed one, I popped off the screw covers on the plastic trim on the inner door sill, then undid the two screws. Applying gentle pressure to pull it away from it's push-in hidden, internal catches, I pulled it away to expose the rear washer water supply pipe. I could rant here about how if I did my job as badly as they appear to do their's, (both designers and builders of these cars), I'd be out of a job and in jail in less than a day having killed at least two people, but I'm sure you've all been there so I won't bother!
I've included a pic of the carpet being desimated then the grey plastic trim pulled away to reveal the not connected 'connection'. I will be adding more as this grows but suffice to say I've checked the windscreen seal (all ok), the door seals (all ok), replaced the absolutely vital pollen filter,(my first car was a Ford Anglia Estate so I know how dangerous pollen can be.....**"$$%*!!!!)which was designed by someone who's childhood hobby was pulling the wings off flies and tying fireworks to cats tails. There was no obvious leaks there.
I have removed the plastic wheel arch covers and there's no little drain pipes leading from the point where the windscreen meets the wing but there is no obvious blockage anyway. Water just runs onto then off the plastic trim in the wheel arch. While they were off, I cleaned the leading edge of the sill where it's supposed to drain. Just some muddy dirt but it'll get worse and corrode if not done.
I've pulled out both of the plastic inserts that fit under the bonnet at the bulkhead. While doing that, I refitte the long push on 'clip' that goes onto the bottom of the windscreen so the trim fits properly. Then I sprayed water into the corners to see how it drained. The majority did but there was a few drips coming in on the wheel arch where I'd removed the carpet. There's a couple of bulkhead penetrators in the upper corner, behind the dash but they just got moist. The water seemed to come from higher, behind the dash.
That was when I discovered how much fun can be had removing (or not as the case may be) the light brown compressed hardened felt under the glove box to access the door pillar/engine bulkhead, which is where the drips were coming from, which also tallied with my wifes description of the water streaming down there as she drives off first thing each day. The fixing screws just rotate.......Okay, writers cramp is kicking in so let me post the pics and then I'll come back after I had a closer look.
By the way, this is my wifes car....I drive a Landrover so the grinder I use on the landy is beckoning....!!

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Edited by allegedly, 24 September 2011 - 01:46 AM.


#12 allegedly

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 02:12 AM

Here's a pic of the carpet peeled back, showing the underlay/soundproofing being lifted prior to me cutting it along the top edge. The water below it was unbeliveable. I've got to repeat this on the drivers side too. I am so happy. All I have to do now is find the leak.
The boss says she can hear water 'sloshing around' at about dash height which is usaully followed by, depending on the 'lock', water running down the trim/bulkhead carpet into the passenger side or drivers side, at the point where the bulkhead meets the door pillar. Incidentally, there is no sun roof so no drains to worry about there.
I can only guess it's sitting on the scuttle (?) below the bonnet/windscreen against the bulkhead at either end. But having sprayed it with the hose pipe, I cannot see where it would gather and lie. The othere pic is the lower of the two plastic inserts against the bulkhead. The leaves seen were the only ones I found but since cleaning them off, there's been no change, it still leaks everytime she moves the car. It continues to come in if she's driving in the rain.
We live on the Northwest Coast of Scotland so it rains a bit here. Well, most of the time to be honest, once summer (?) is done.
Has anyone got any suggestions? I am looking into the fan/demist facet this weekend so if I get a result, I let you know.
Cheers
Rob

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#13 allegedly

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 02:18 AM

Last point for tonight, If you got a leak and you probably wouldn't be reading this if you don't, I suggest you check under the passenger seat as the same engineer/designer decided it'd be a wheeze to put an electronic device there where it can sit in it's own pool of water. As we all know, electronic devices, which are cheap as chips as the saying goes, love a bit of water.
So if (I belive) your windows and central locking are a bit iffy, check this out to see if it's got it's own little jaccuzi.
Night
Rob

#14 chrispb123456

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 09:18 AM

Hi there in bonnie Scotland

There's quite a few possibility's one being the scuttle tray you have already dealt with, next and this is a must do if you have a sunroof?
Undo the screws from the rear end of the front wheel arch liner, you may have to remove mudflap if fitted.
Pull the liner away from the body now dig out all the mud, leaves and rubbish thats collected there making sure you clean the drain hole at the bottom, if you do have a sunroof you will probably find the drain tubes buried in the muck.
staying with the sunroof (if you have one) lower the front corners of the roof lining to check the drain tubes are still connected to the sunroof, they have been known to come apart.

If you don't have the sunroof still clean then out behind the wheels as this can lead to premature rotting away of the floor/bulkhead.

Other possibilities are;
Windscreen leaking around the bonded area.

Rear screen washer tube become disconnected in passenger footwell (common problem)

Condensate from aircon leaking into car instead of drain tube in bulkhead.

Heater matrix leaking (and loss of coolant)

see how you get on.

Edited by chrispb123456, 24 September 2011 - 09:24 AM.


#15 chrispb123456

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 09:53 AM

Duh

See most of the points have already been covered, one other point was do you have roof bars? not sure if they could cause a leak into the roof lining? do you think the sloshing noise could be coming from the roof lining.

#16 allegedly

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Posted 24 November 2011 - 03:11 PM

Hi Chris, thanks for the reply. To my message as well. Sorry not been on here for a while, but I'm back into the Galaxy after sorting out a leaking bathroom! What is it they say, never rains etc...It bloody does here!!
To recap, both footwells are soaking. I've stripped out the sound deadening/underlay from the passenger side and can see little rivulets of water running down the curved area of the wheel arch in the passenger footwell.
This is after and during rain. The car hasn't been moved for two days now but if I carefully dry the area involved, which is stripped back to just the painted metal and then rock the car, the little runs of water appear. They seem to run out after a while as repeated rocking seems to empty what ever/where ever the water is sitting.
The car is the 1.9 diesel tdi ghia. No sunroofs, thank god. But it does have the two roof bars/rails. However, the headlining is dry all over. Not a mark.
I even peeled it back slightly at the top of the A pillar to see if there was any sign of water ingress at the top, running down the angled pillar as that appears to be where the water leaks down from. That is, at the base of the A pillar, behind the dash at about upper glove box height. A warning light on the dash about an airbag fault led me to think maybe this was the source and it was running down past the pillar mounted airbag. But no, nothing.
I've taken out the little trim piece with the vent hole,next to the front 'quarter' light, at the end of the top of the dash, nothing.
Taken off the trim at the side of the dash so I can look into sidemounting area of the glove box. There is some staining on the felt. That just confused me more.
I've taken off the upper trim of the glove box itself, to look behind it. Nothing.
My next move was to lie upside down in the footwell, I'm six feet tall so no mean feat, and force my hand up behind the glove box. I can feel the back of the electric motor thats behind the glove box (ended up cutting an access hole in the shaped felt there, that'll go back with duct tape) and that has damp patches near the top. The bit of felt on the bulkhead/side panel is wet at this point so I am close.
Trouble is, I can't see all the way up and I can't see clearly down inside the engine bay, against the bulk head, what penetrates it up there so I can maybe get at it and try to reseat it or seal around it.
I renewed the pollen filter as stated and though it's seated properly as far as I can tell, I keep suspecting this but would that explain the leak being in both footwells with exactly the same symptoms, that is, running down the curve of the wheel arch?
Any suggestions gratefully received. And this is just the one side, the other to do yet!

Edited by allegedly, 24 November 2011 - 03:15 PM.


#17 chrispb123456

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Posted 24 November 2011 - 03:39 PM

Ages ago someone mentioned a seam at the top of the wheel arch that was causing problems but iirc only on one side, only sure way I can think is to take away the guesswork would be to remove the facia although wouldn't relish the thought (big job).

I think if it was me I would rule out the windscreen leaking by having it changed (usually 70 excess on your insurance)

#18 allegedly

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Posted 24 November 2011 - 08:09 PM

Funny you should mention that, a friend who used to work in a ford garage,who's also a bit stumped over this one, said they once had a galaxy in where they couldn't pin a leak down accurately but it seemed to be a failure of a seal at a point where a couple of layers of panels come together above the wheel arch/bulkhead area. He said they just ended up coating the whole area with tiger seal and that did the trick. That is on the cards here. In fact, a long handled paint brush dripping tiger may be going all over the place. I just don't like the idea of black gunky stuff visible everywhere!
Also, getting the screen re-seated is my next move.